26 Apr 2005 02:46:14
Gollum
bending at the waist?

All videos and books about pool stances say you should "bend at the
waist". What they dont explain is the ideal angle of your torso when
you bend. Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
pain when I play pool and I need advice.

Lets say you were to line up your body 45 degrees with the cue and
line of aim. Your body is not facing the direction of the cue
obviously, so if you were to "bend at the waist", what does that
really mean? Does that mean your torso bends into the shot, twisting
your torso at an angle? Your torso is now in line with the cue at 90
degrees, but your body is still at the 45 degree angle... is this what
it means to bend at the waist?

On the other hand, you could line up 45 degrees to the cue and bend
straight down instead.. Your body is at 45 degrees, your torso is at
45 degrees also. There is no twist between the torso and body. You
arent leaning straight into the shot but at an angle with the cue.
Your head is brought over the cue stick... Is this the typical bending
of the waist?

So I'm basically asking, should the torso be in line with the lower
body or at an angle with the lower body? What do most pool players
mean by bending at the waist?

Gollum


26 Apr 2005 12:55:30
Patrick Johnson
Re: bending at the waist?

Gollum wrote:

> ... should the torso be in line with the lower
> body or at an angle with the lower body? What do most pool players
> mean by bending at the waist?

These are two different questions.

1. The torso will probably be at an angle to the hips -- otherwise the
hip tends to get in the way of the stroke.

2. Most pool players mean bending over, not twisting, even though
bending over probably involves twisting.

About the torso/hip twist: there's a tradeoff between head/neck comfort
and torso/hip comfort. If you bend over facing the shot squarely, you
won't have to twist your neck as much but you might have to tuck your
elbow to get your stick under your chin and twist your torso to get your
hip out of the way of your stroke. If you face more toward the stick,
you won't have to twist your torso or tuck your elbow as much but you
might have to twist your neck more to face the shot squarely.

Pat Johnson
Chicago



26 Apr 2005 07:53:55
michael t
Re: bending at the waist?

Gollum wrote:
> Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
> pain when I play pool and I need advice.
>
> Gollum

You should consider finding an instructor with a very good
understanding mechanics. As we all know, there are differing thoughts
on stance - open vs closed, how low bend over, head alignment, etc. I
believe these differences exist because, outside the very basics, ones
stance must be built around ones own body (height, flexability, eye
dominance, build, etc.).

A good instructor would be able to work with you on your particular
needs to build a stance that works for you - hopefully finding a stance
that allows you to play well without backpain.


michael



26 Apr 2005 16:05:11
ottomatic
Re: bending at the waist?


"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:2esr61l4rnjjos5rs9thgorjpi06grglhn@4ax.com...
> All videos and books about pool stances say you should "bend at the
> waist". What they dont explain is the ideal angle of your torso when
> you bend. Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
> pain when I play pool and I need advice.

1. watch good players - observe their stance
stances vary greatly between players

2. if you can't do 1 above - get some videos of pro matches

3. if you are experiencing pain from anything even remotely resembling
a normal stance, you should see a doctor. none of the bending or twisting
motions you describe should result in pain

4. try WebbMD

Otto


>
> Lets say you were to line up your body 45 degrees with the cue and
> line of aim. Your body is not facing the direction of the cue
> obviously, so if you were to "bend at the waist", what does that
> really mean? Does that mean your torso bends into the shot, twisting
> your torso at an angle? Your torso is now in line with the cue at 90
> degrees, but your body is still at the 45 degree angle... is this what
> it means to bend at the waist?
>
> On the other hand, you could line up 45 degrees to the cue and bend
> straight down instead.. Your body is at 45 degrees, your torso is at
> 45 degrees also. There is no twist between the torso and body. You
> arent leaning straight into the shot but at an angle with the cue.
> Your head is brought over the cue stick... Is this the typical bending
> of the waist?
>
> So I'm basically asking, should the torso be in line with the lower
> body or at an angle with the lower body? What do most pool players
> mean by bending at the waist?
>
> Gollum




26 Apr 2005 19:28:09
Bob Jewett
Re: bending at the waist?

> Gollum wrote:
>> Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
>> pain when I play pool and I need advice.

> You should consider finding an instructor with a very good
> understanding [of] mechanics. ...

I think this is bad advice unless the instructor is smart enough
to get this guy some kind of medical help. Maybe he needs
physical therapy, or an operation, or something. Maybe he
just needs to work on his back muscles.

I don't know of any pool instructor who is qualified to deal with
this issue.

--

Bob Jewett
http://www.sfbilliards.com/



26 Apr 2005 15:38:54
Gollum
Re: bending at the waist?

On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 16:05:11 GMT, "ottomatic" <spamout@nospam.net >
wrote:

>
>"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:2esr61l4rnjjos5rs9thgorjpi06grglhn@4ax.com...
>> All videos and books about pool stances say you should "bend at the
>> waist". What they dont explain is the ideal angle of your torso when
>> you bend. Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
>> pain when I play pool and I need advice.
>
>1. watch good players - observe their stance
>stances vary greatly between players
>
>2. if you can't do 1 above - get some videos of pro matches
>
>3. if you are experiencing pain from anything even remotely resembling
>a normal stance, you should see a doctor. none of the bending or twisting
>motions you describe should result in pain
>
>4. try WebbMD
>
>Otto


Ok, so it is normal to bend at an angle and not feel pain? I prefer to
line up my shot this way but it hurts a lot, I feel a huge pull in my
legs and back. I am very tall and highly inflexible, I'm sure that
plays a role... ..but if most people can twist their torso and bend
forward with no pain and do that over the course of a lifetime, that
means I have a real structural problem somewhere..
.
Do you think I should adapt a stance to fit my body, or try to change
my body so I can twist comfortably?

Gollum

>
>
>>
>> Lets say you were to line up your body 45 degrees with the cue and
>> line of aim. Your body is not facing the direction of the cue
>> obviously, so if you were to "bend at the waist", what does that
>> really mean? Does that mean your torso bends into the shot, twisting
>> your torso at an angle? Your torso is now in line with the cue at 90
>> degrees, but your body is still at the 45 degree angle... is this what
>> it means to bend at the waist?
>>
>> On the other hand, you could line up 45 degrees to the cue and bend
>> straight down instead.. Your body is at 45 degrees, your torso is at
>> 45 degrees also. There is no twist between the torso and body. You
>> arent leaning straight into the shot but at an angle with the cue.
>> Your head is brought over the cue stick... Is this the typical bending
>> of the waist?
>>
>> So I'm basically asking, should the torso be in line with the lower
>> body or at an angle with the lower body? What do most pool players
>> mean by bending at the waist?
>>
>> Gollum
>



27 Apr 2005 06:00:27
ottomatic
Re: bending at the waist?


"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:4g9t615sne1iers20dg2i3345m8sgm7ef8@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 16:05:11 GMT, "ottomatic" <spamout@nospam.net>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:2esr61l4rnjjos5rs9thgorjpi06grglhn@4ax.com...
> >> All videos and books about pool stances say you should "bend at the
> >> waist". What they dont explain is the ideal angle of your torso when
> >> you bend. Please take a moment to follow my reasoning, because I am in
> >> pain when I play pool and I need advice.
> >
> >1. watch good players - observe their stance
> >stances vary greatly between players
> >
> >2. if you can't do 1 above - get some videos of pro matches
> >
> >3. if you are experiencing pain from anything even remotely resembling
> >a normal stance, you should see a doctor. none of the bending or twisting
> >motions you describe should result in pain
> >
> >4. try WebbMD
> >
> >Otto
>
>
> Ok, so it is normal to bend at an angle and not feel pain? I prefer to
> line up my shot this way but it hurts a lot, I feel a huge pull in my
> legs and back. I am very tall and highly inflexible, I'm sure that
> plays a role... ..but if most people can twist their torso and bend
> forward with no pain and do that over the course of a lifetime, that
> means I have a real structural problem somewhere..
> .
> Do you think I should adapt a stance to fit my body, or try to change
> my body so I can twist comfortably?
>
> Gollum

not to repeat myself, but, to repeat, you must have some kind of medical
problem/condition - pool stance is the least of your problems and being tall
has nothing, directly, to do with it

do you engage in any other mildly physical activities
and do they cause you pain?

Otto
>
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Lets say you were to line up your body 45 degrees with the cue and
> >> line of aim. Your body is not facing the direction of the cue
> >> obviously, so if you were to "bend at the waist", what does that
> >> really mean? Does that mean your torso bends into the shot, twisting
> >> your torso at an angle? Your torso is now in line with the cue at 90
> >> degrees, but your body is still at the 45 degree angle... is this what
> >> it means to bend at the waist?
> >>
> >> On the other hand, you could line up 45 degrees to the cue and bend
> >> straight down instead.. Your body is at 45 degrees, your torso is at
> >> 45 degrees also. There is no twist between the torso and body. You
> >> arent leaning straight into the shot but at an angle with the cue.
> >> Your head is brought over the cue stick... Is this the typical bending
> >> of the waist?
> >>
> >> So I'm basically asking, should the torso be in line with the lower
> >> body or at an angle with the lower body? What do most pool players
> >> mean by bending at the waist?
> >>
> >> Gollum
> >
>




26 Apr 2005 21:06:27
Gollum
Re: bending at the waist?


>>
>> Ok, so it is normal to bend at an angle and not feel pain? I prefer to
>> line up my shot this way but it hurts a lot, I feel a huge pull in my
>> legs and back. I am very tall and highly inflexible, I'm sure that
>> plays a role... ..but if most people can twist their torso and bend
>> forward with no pain and do that over the course of a lifetime, that
>> means I have a real structural problem somewhere..
>> .
>> Do you think I should adapt a stance to fit my body, or try to change
>> my body so I can twist comfortably?
>>
>> Gollum
>
>not to repeat myself, but, to repeat, you must have some kind of medical
>problem/condition - pool stance is the least of your problems and being tall
>has nothing, directly, to do with it
>
>do you engage in any other mildly physical activities
>and do they cause you pain?
>
>Otto
>>

Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings all
the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but this
doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking around,...
but this lower back pain and leg pain just happens during pool..

:)




27 Apr 2005 01:11:48
Mail Man
Re: bending at the waist?


"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:rkst619u41v30pjtmciulvng69fgrqjngr@4ax.com...
>
> >>
> >> Ok, so it is normal to bend at an angle and not feel pain? I prefer to
> >> line up my shot this way but it hurts a lot, I feel a huge pull in my
> >> legs and back. I am very tall and highly inflexible, I'm sure that
> >> plays a role... ..but if most people can twist their torso and bend
> >> forward with no pain and do that over the course of a lifetime, that
> >> means I have a real structural problem somewhere..
> >> .
> >> Do you think I should adapt a stance to fit my body, or try to change
> >> my body so I can twist comfortably?
> >>
> >> Gollum
> >
> >not to repeat myself, but, to repeat, you must have some kind of medical
> >problem/condition - pool stance is the least of your problems and being
tall
> >has nothing, directly, to do with it
> >
> >do you engage in any other mildly physical activities
> >and do they cause you pain?
> >
> >Otto
> >>
>
> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings all
> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but this
> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking around,...
> but this lower back pain and leg pain just happens during pool..
>
> :)

In your case, Otto and Bob Jewett are BOTH right, each in his own way. You
need to GO SEE A DOCTOR who is qualified to diagnose spinal injury or
aberration. Concentrate on the Lumbar region. It sounds to me like you are
pinching nerves in certain positions -- I have this problem, but it is not
serious enough to be distracting to me (i.e., I can't use it as an excuse
when I'm playing crappy --DARN!).

If your doctor recommends some sort of physical therapy, DO IT! This is
closely observed and carefully regulated so that you don't injure yourself
while building up the necessary part of your skeletal and muscular structure
and is, from all accounts I have received, very successful. All other
options require some sort of surgery, either inpatient or outpatient,
depending upon what needs to be done.

Some may laugh, but I can see, from my own limited experience with lower
back pain and pinching nerves, how easy it would be to wind up permanently
in a wheel chair just from bending over to pick up a piece of paper -- this
nearly happened to me about 6 years ago and comes from a serious back injury
dating to 1973. In other words, DON'T FOOL AROUND!

Short of this, try a more "boxed-up" stance (one of Pat's suggestions), like
a snooker stance. With your feet set 90 degrees perpendicular to the cue,
you will have to line up with your shooting hand almost against your hip,
but when you lean over to line up, this will cause you to twist your torso
in the OPPOSITE direction of a normal pool stance to get a good line up.
The drawback to this is that there will be a lot of weight/stress on the
bridge arm that does not normally occur in the far more balanced posture of
the normal pool stance -- this could also affect your back. This will be
uncomfortable (i.e., unfamiliar) at first, but has been used "forever" by
the top snooker players in the world and, over time, can be learned.
However, if this also causes ANY pain, DO NOT DO this either -- GO SEE A
DOCTOR!

Mike Collier
Oak Harbor, WA



27 Apr 2005 06:12:12
Re: bending at the waist?


Gollum, chiropractors are trained and licensed to diagnose and treat
mechanical sources of low back and leg pain. Ask around and find out
who a good one would be in your neighborhood. I've treated thousands
of cases similar to what yours sounds like, so that may be just the
ticket for you.

Doc

> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings all
> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but
this
> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking around,...
> but this lower back pain and leg pain just happens during pool..
>
> :)



27 Apr 2005 13:45:44
ottomatic
Re: bending at the waist?


"Gollum" <cartmanbaseball@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:rkst619u41v30pjtmciulvng69fgrqjngr@4ax.com...
>
> >>
> >> Ok, so it is normal to bend at an angle and not feel pain? I prefer to
> >> line up my shot this way but it hurts a lot, I feel a huge pull in my
> >> legs and back. I am very tall and highly inflexible, I'm sure that
> >> plays a role... ..but if most people can twist their torso and bend
> >> forward with no pain and do that over the course of a lifetime, that
> >> means I have a real structural problem somewhere..
> >> .
> >> Do you think I should adapt a stance to fit my body, or try to change
> >> my body so I can twist comfortably?
> >>
> >> Gollum
> >
> >not to repeat myself, but, to repeat, you must have some kind of medical
> >problem/condition - pool stance is the least of your problems and being
tall
> >has nothing, directly, to do with it
> >
> >do you engage in any other mildly physical activities
> >and do they cause you pain?
> >
> >Otto
> >>
>
> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings all
> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but this
> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking around,...

from this info, I think we can conclude that pool stance is not the
cause of your problem, and that no amount of tinkering with your stance
is going to help

did I mention a doctor?

Otto





> but this lower back pain and leg pain just happens during pool..
>
> :)
>
>




29 Apr 2005 21:28:27
Gollum
Re: bending at the waist?


>>
>> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings all
>> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but this
>> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
>> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking around,...
>
>from this info, I think we can conclude that pool stance is not the
>cause of your problem, and that no amount of tinkering with your stance
>is going to help
>
>did I mention a doctor?
>
>Otto
>

Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that might
be important... what do you guys think?

Gollum



30 Apr 2005 05:42:23
Re: bending at the waist?


> Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
> bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that might
> be important... what do you guys think?
>
> Gollum

No. No difference. I think that you're nit-picking yourself into a
confused stupor. Go to a chiropractor.

Doc



30 Apr 2005 09:46:21
vader93490
Re: bending at the waist?

gulfport...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
> > bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that
might
> > be important... what do you guys think?
> >
> > Gollum
>
> No. No difference. I think that you're nit-picking yourself into a
> confused stupor. Go to a chiropractor.
>
> Doc

You have got to be kidding, going to a chiropractor will only be more
confusing. If a person has what could be a potential spinal problem,
the last person to go see about an issue like that (or any
spinal/medical issue for that matter) is a chiropractor. Chiropractors
are NOT doctors, much as they'd like to think & dream that they are.
An orthopedic doctor is the person to go see regarding a spinal
problem. If you're unsure of where to find one, then I'd suggest
consulting your family physician to locate one.



30 Apr 2005 18:47:23
Gollum
Re: bending at the waist?

On 30 Apr 2005 05:42:23 -0700, gulfportdoc@yahoo.com wrote:

>
>> Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
>> bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that might
>> be important... what do you guys think?
>>
>> Gollum
>
>No. No difference. I think that you're nit-picking yourself into a
>confused stupor. Go to a chiropractor.
>
>Doc


I'm in a confused stupor, and I'm not even drunk!




01 May 2005 02:31:25
Re: bending at the waist?


Gollum wrote:
> >>
> >> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings
all
> >> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but
this
> >> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
> >> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking
around,...
> >
> >from this info, I think we can conclude that pool stance is not the
> >cause of your problem, and that no amount of tinkering with your
stance
> >is going to help
> >
> >did I mention a doctor?
> >
> >Otto
> >
>
> Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
> bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that might
> be important... what do you guys think?
>
> Gollum


I have had back pain for years. It is part of the aging process for
some of us. Unless you have injured it to the point of not being able
to walk, I doubt there is anything that can be done.

It is strange that I can lift 125 lbs without pain, but bending over to
wash my hands causes pain. Wierd huh? But that's the way it is.

If you have the same problem I have, certain postures causes pain,
where other postures don't. Am I right?

If I am right, the only relief I get is if I take an NSAID
(Non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug). They are over the counter drugs
such as asperin, ibuprofen, Aleve and etc. Be cautious as all drugs can
have a side effect.

Going to a physician is the best advice. At least that way you know
that you've done the best thing that you can do yourself in todays
world to find the problem. But, don't expect much. Usually they
can't/won't do anything except prescribe what I stated earlier and tell
you to build up your abdominal muscles, eat right, don't smoke and
blah, blah, blah.

In conclusion, if I were you, I'd adapt to a painfree stance.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Hank



01 May 2005 02:36:05
Re: bending at the waist?

>From Vader:

vader93490 Apr 30, 9:46 am show options

Newsgroups: rec.sport.billiard
From: "vader93490" <vader93...@aol.com > - Find messages by this author

Date: 30 Apr 2005 09:46:21 -0700
Local: Sat,Apr 30 2005 9:46 am
Subject: Re: bending at the waist?
Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show
original | Report Abuse



gulfport...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
> > bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that
might
> > be important... what do you guys think?

> > Gollum


> No. No difference. I think that you're nit-picking yourself into a
> confused stupor. Go to a chiropractor.


> Doc



You have got to be kidding, going to a chiropractor will only be more
confusing. If a person has what could be a potential spinal problem,
the last person to go see about an issue like that (or any
spinal/medical issue for that matter) is a chiropractor. Chiropractors

are NOT doctors, much as they'd like to think & dream that they are.
An orthopedic doctor is the person to go see regarding a spinal
problem. If you're unsure of where to find one, then I'd suggest
consulting your family physician to locate one.


>From Hank:

And doctors are not the Gods they think they are.

Hank <~~~~thinks the whole medical field is out of whack, overpriced
and over-rated.



01 May 2005 08:57:26
vader93490
Re: bending at the waist?

I never said doctors were gods, Hank... there are good doctors as well
as bad ones. There are also good lawyers and bad lawyers, good auto
mechanics and bad auto mechanics. You'll find good & bad in any
profession, whatever it may be.

Going to see a chiropractor about a bad back makes no sense. It's
about as logical a move as making an appointment to see a dentist to
fix a broken radiator hose in your car.

The only person to seek out regarding a bad back or other spinal
problem like Gollum described at the beginning of this discussion
thread is a qualified orthopedic physician, NOT some unqualified
pretender like a chiropractor. Why? Because chiropractors are not
real medical doctors and they are completely & totally unqualified to
make a diagnosis regarding an issue as valuable to the human body as
the spine is.



01 May 2005 11:58:50
Patrick Johnson
Re: bending at the waist?

vader93490 wrote:

> The only person to seek out regarding a bad back or other spinal
> problem like Gollum described at the beginning of this discussion
> thread is a qualified orthopedic physician, NOT some unqualified
> pretender like a chiropractor. Why? Because chiropractors are not
> real medical doctors and they are completely & totally unqualified to
> make a diagnosis regarding an issue as valuable to the human body as
> the spine is.

What qualifies you to give this medical advice?

Pat Johnson
Chicago


01 May 2005 13:14:40
vader93490
Re: bending at the waist?

Well Pat, the knowledge comes from discussions with family friends who
are licensed practicing *qualified* medical doctors and research on the
internet.

Additionally, I've seen friends & family both that went to these people
for medical treatment and unfortunately they wound up worse off than if
they'd gone to see a proper orthopedic physician in the first place.

One notable chiropractic work example that comes to my mind would be a
good friend that went to see a chiropractor for some neck pain
treatment. The chiropractor did some "adjustments" (that's the term
they use for their treatment/diagnosis), and the end result? My
friend's neck was badly broken by this "doctor" and he had to wear a
halo for the next 3 months plus he had to have surgery in his neck to
undo the damage inflicted.

Also Pat, since chiropractors are not medical doctors, they aren't
required by law to carry the same amount of medical malpractice
insurance that real medical doctors are required to carry. Therefore
when a mishap occurs, there isn't as much money in it for the person
that's hurt and since there isn't the same amount of insurance money, a
lawyer won't go after chiropractic offices as readily as if a mishap
had occured in a real doctor's office.

I'm not saying that doctors are perfect, Pat. But they are more
qualified to give medical advice and treatment than chiropractors when
it comes to orthopedic issues. Thus, that's why I feel Gollum would be
much better off if he consulted a real orthopedic doctor and not a
chiropractor for a potential spinal issue. I think if you did some
investigation about the subject on your own you'd discover that the
amount of mishaps occuring in chiropractic offices would be much bigger
than mishaps in a real medical doctor's office.



02 May 2005 00:15:10
ottomatic
Re: bending at the waist?

these back pain discussions are fun and all,
but am I the only one who understood, belatedly perhaps,
that Gollum is a Troll-um?

Ot
<ninebal310@aol.com > wrote in message
news:1114939885.403003.124620@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>
> Gollum wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Well I can swing a golf club without pain... I pull my hamstrings
> all
> > >> the time when I run though... I've had carpal tunnel syndrome but
> this
> > >> doesnt effect my back... I have had back pain from bad posture
> > >> before... I pull my back out routinely from just walking
> around,...
> > >
> > >from this info, I think we can conclude that pool stance is not the
> > >cause of your problem, and that no amount of tinkering with your
> stance
> > >is going to help
> > >
> > >did I mention a doctor?
> > >
> > >Otto
> > >
> >
> > Okay, having said that, do you think there is a difference between
> > bending from the hips vs bending from the waist? Perhaps that might
> > be important... what do you guys think?
> >
> > Gollum
>
>
> I have had back pain for years. It is part of the aging process for
> some of us. Unless you have injured it to the point of not being able
> to walk, I doubt there is anything that can be done.
>
> It is strange that I can lift 125 lbs without pain, but bending over to
> wash my hands causes pain. Wierd huh? But that's the way it is.
>
> If you have the same problem I have, certain postures causes pain,
> where other postures don't. Am I right?
>
> If I am right, the only relief I get is if I take an NSAID
> (Non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug). They are over the counter drugs
> such as asperin, ibuprofen, Aleve and etc. Be cautious as all drugs can
> have a side effect.
>
> Going to a physician is the best advice. At least that way you know
> that you've done the best thing that you can do yourself in todays
> world to find the problem. But, don't expect much. Usually they
> can't/won't do anything except prescribe what I stated earlier and tell
> you to build up your abdominal muscles, eat right, don't smoke and
> blah, blah, blah.
>
> In conclusion, if I were you, I'd adapt to a painfree stance.
>
> Good luck and keep us posted.
>
> Hank
>




02 May 2005 17:42:18
HopsNBarley
Re: bending at the waist?


> vader93490 wrote:
>
> > The only person to seek out regarding a bad back or other spinal
> > problem like Gollum described at the beginning of this discussion
> > thread is a qualified orthopedic physician, NOT some unqualified
> > pretender like a chiropractor. Why? Because chiropractors are not
> > real medical doctors and they are completely & totally unqualified to
> > make a diagnosis regarding an issue as valuable to the human body as
> > the spine is.

PJ wrote:
> What qualifies you to give this medical advice?


I think you may have jumped the gun on this on PJ. Are you saying what
Vader said doesn't make much sense to you? My wife is a nurse and she
worked in an emergency room for some time, and I've heard her on countless
occasions repeat exactly this statement. This obviously doesn't qualify me
either, but common sense runs in my family.

What qualifies gulfportdoc to give out medical advice? I'm disappointed in
you PJ, I expected you to have corrected the bad information....Unless of
course you are a chiropractor?

Glenn<---agrees with Vader 100%




02 May 2005 22:02:24
Patrick Johnson
Re: bending at the waist?

HopsNBarley wrote:

> I think you may have jumped the gun on this on PJ. Are you saying what
> Vader said doesn't make much sense to you?

Vader argues that we shouldn't trust chiropractors because they don't
have credentials. That's not true of chiropractors (they have to meet
postgraduate education standards and are regulated and licensed in every
state, just like MDs), but I bet it's very true of Vader himself. By
his own standard, we should trust him MUCH less than chiropractors, who
he says are quacks. Basing your own belief on what your wife says is,
well, loyal of you.

Pat Johnson
Chicago


03 May 2005 02:57:32
Re: bending at the waist?


Patrick Johnson wrote:
> HopsNBarley wrote:
>
> > I think you may have jumped the gun on this on PJ. Are you saying
what
> > Vader said doesn't make much sense to you?
>
> Vader argues that we shouldn't trust chiropractors because they don't

> have credentials. That's not true of chiropractors (they have to
meet
> postgraduate education standards and are regulated and licensed in
every
> state, just like MDs), but I bet it's very true of Vader himself. By

> his own standard, we should trust him MUCH less than chiropractors,
who
> he says are quacks. Basing your own belief on what your wife says
is,
> well, loyal of you.
>
> Pat Johnson
> Chicago

It is my OPINION that chiropractors are great for treating
psychosomatic illnesses. Other than that, they are pretty much useless.

In this state, they advertise that they can treat everything from heart
disease to ingrown toenails. This is where I have a problem with them.
Lots of people go to them, the insurance companies pay the outrageous
charges for x-rays that prove nothing and physical therapy that does
nothing. It is one of the biggest scams to come along.

Hank <~~~knows a few chiropractors



03 May 2005 08:30:32
HopsNBarley
Re: bending at the waist?


Patrick Johnson wrote:
> Vader argues that we shouldn't trust chiropractors because they don't
> have credentials.

Anyone can have credentials, but chripractors are just not educated as well
as REAL medical doctors. Who would you want evaluating your back problem?

> Basing your own belief on what your wife says is,
> well, loyal of you.

At 37 weeks pregnant, the last thing you want to do is argue....

Glenn




03 May 2005 14:43:07
Patrick Johnson
Re: bending at the waist?

HopsNBarley wrote:

> At 37 weeks pregnant, the last thing you want to do is argue...

Or get very far from the car...

pj
chgo



05 May 2005 08:27:18
Jack Stein
Re: bending at the waist?


Patrick Johnson wrote:

> Vader argues that we shouldn't trust chiropractors because they don't
> have credentials.

I believe Vader argued chiropractors are not MEDICAL DOCTORS. Just
about everyone has credentials it seems... I guess you think no one
notices how you change things around to suit your whims... They are not
medical doctors, exactly as Vader has stated.

I suspect his point is a chiropractors credentials are below a licensed
orthopedic DOCTORS credentials, so why trust your body to the one with
lessor credentials.

If I had a back problem and had a choice of going to the worlds greatest
orthopedic doctor or the worlds greatest chiropractor, I probably would
opt for the doctor.

Everyone I know that has gone to a chiropractor seems to have a funny
curve in their spine that requires weekly/monthly adjustments until the
money runs out. Their customers generally swear by them, so I guess they
are doing something right.
--
Jack
http://jbstein.com